Animator Don Hertzfeldt has somewhat quietly been building up a massive cult following since the mid-'90s, known both for his squiggly but evocative animation style and bizarre catch phrases like "my spoon is too big." It's helped that he's partnered with Mike Judge for half of the last decade to co-curate the touring Animation Show. Since then, he's been blogging and animating more of his shorts — the latest being a series of short stories titled Wisdom Teeth out late last year. And he's been watching a lot of movies. We hopped on IM with Hertzfeldt to get his picks on flicks that are sadly underappreciated, and accidentally discovered why he's so obsessed with "survival stories."

Watch Don's latest, Wisdom Teeth [external link]

Touching The Void

Probably one of my favorite documentaries. It also helps that I like survival stories, too. Whenever I go to film festivals now and sort through the programs and tickets, I try and see as many documentaries as I can. I've learned that when you catch a narrative film, there's usually a 50/50 chance that it's a total dog. You'll have to sit through it sadly 'til the end or try and slip out the door and waste that timeslot. But with documentaries, even if it's badly made, at least I'm probably going to learn something.

I can't remember [where I heard of this]. Not at a festival. I'm not sure. For equally unknown reasons I can't stand biopics, like I think 90 percent of every biopic made ever made is terrible. But my next project, if it is ever made, is a survival story. But anyhow. Touching The Void is sort of one where the less you know going in, probably the better. It shares a bit of the same DNA as 127 Hours. I also really liked that Everest book, Into Thin Air.

“I can’t stand biopics, like I think 90 percent of every biopic made ever made is terrible.”

What is it about these types of stories that appeal to you?

Hmm. I am really thinking about this. You know, I've never really actually thought about it, but connecting the dots, I also have a not-morbid-at-all row of Holocaust literature on my bookshelf. Also survival stories. I think maybe the common thread is when really terrible things happen to you, you sort of see the world differently. Through completely new lenses. You're sort of shaken, but shaken awake. I talked about this a lot when I Am So Proud Of You came out: It's often not until something bad happens, an accident, a disaster, someone dies, or even on a smaller scale, someone breaking up with you, that you become stronger and actually appreciate things. I've noticed this a lot.

I think most people try to bury these things because death and dying is sort of a scary taboo in modern culture, you know? But it sort of creates a weird attitude where people wander around pretending they'll never die, and things will never go wrong, and as a result they're not really living, or appreciating all the things going on around them.

It's like Batman's origin story: Once you're pushed to your limits by something happening, it's only then do you find what you're capable of.

I should have just said that. There's another really interesting documentary, totally not for everyone, that wasn't on my list called A Certain Kind Of Death. It's about the LA coroner's department and what happens to unclaimed bodies that are discovered. It's hard to watch because it's not squeamish at all, but I thought it was totally fascinating. I never would have known that there's a guy in the crematorium whose job it is to stab the corpses with a long machete thing to drain them of all the chemicals before they are burned. And another guy's job to stand there with a hose and wash all the corpse-y stuff down the drain. I can't believe the tangent this conversation has already taken, but that's worth seeing too if you don't mind dead people.

“I never would have known that there’s a guy in the crematorium whose job it is to stab the corpses with a long machete thing to drain them of all the chemicals before they are burned.”

Play Time

Watch this one on the biggest screen you can find. I'm not even that big a fan of these "Mr. Hulot" movies, but this is a weird and amazing masterpiece. The DVD even has a great introduction by Terry Jones. For the most part it's story-less. It's quasi-Paris of the future, a massive canvas. Every other setup is massive. People [are] walking everywhere, [there's] beautiful camerawork. Mr. Hulot pops in and out of frame every now and then, out of place, and typically Chaplin-y. (I took great pains to avoid saying "Chaplin-esque" and sounding pretentious.) [But] he's out of place as usual and sort of coping to adapt with this new modern living.

It's hard to do it justice but the direction is just so clever and the choreography between all these little elements going on in the frame [are] so well done. I can't imagine seeing it on an average-sized screen because everyone would be reduced to dots and you'd miss a thousand little subtle things. I'm not sure, but Play Time seems like it must have been shot in 70mm. It seems perfectly suited to IMAX or something.

What's beautiful about Play Time, at least how I remember it, is how long the takes are and how static the camera often is. It reminds me a lot of silent movies and is like what I do as well: I hate overcutting and weird unmotivated camera moves. It just sort of rolls and lets the action unfold in front of you.

“I hate overcutting and weird unmotivated camera moves.”

The Assassination Of Jesse James By The Coward Robert Ford

I am still baffled by how many people haven't seen it or plain hated it. [I guess] it's long... ponderous? I don't know. Maybe people expected Brad Pitt to be throwing people out windows. I got a screener of it, so, right away, it was probably my favorite movie of that year. The cinematography's done somewhat famously by Roger Deakins and it will melt your face it's so beautiful. The soundtrack's by Nick Cave. What more do you want?

The Staircase

Watch the trailer on YouTube.

This next one is a documentary miniseries that there isn't much to discuss about unfortunately. I don't want to give any of it away but I remember getting really sucked into it. It's about a murder trial and I can't remember how long it is but it's extremely difficult to stop watching as you go through the episodes. At the end of each segment you find yourself convinced of a completely different outcome as you were in the previous one. It is a real event, the documentary is behind the scenes of both the prosecution and the defense. It's the sort of trial where I would have hated to be on the jury. This is one to watch with a total blank slate.

El Topo

This finally came to DVD maybe a couple years ago? Oh, it's beautiful madness. I'm sure it all means something very deep and interesting as well, it's been a while since I've seen it so I'm a bit foggy. But it can be appreciated equally on the surface for the bats*** crazy that it is. I mean, just read the Netflix writeup: "But first, he must defeat four master gunfighters and dig a tunnel to free a colony of deformed underground dwellers from their dark confines." And that's just scratching the surface. How can anyone not want to see that? It just struck me as a sort of beautiful dream. Maybe the most impressive thing being the amazing scenery and weird locations that were obviously all scouted or built in real life.

Is it a mark of pride, like, knowing of all these movies that most people might consider "obscure?"

“I’m mostly just saddened that most people will probably rent Shrek 4 instead of something like El Topo and not ever know what they’re missing.”

The Fall [Rated R]

Hardly anyone I've met bothered to see it. Tarsem's only made two movies and they're both fantastic to look at. I remember showing my girlfriend at the time The Fall and when I came back into the room she was crying like I've never seen her cry before. It's actually a really sad story, though for some reason it didn't connect with me in quite the same way.

It's about a guy who wants to kill himself, in a hospital telling this adorable little foreign girl — who apparently didn't speak English and spoke all her lines phonetically — this strange fantasy story and we watch it play out. I'm told they scouted these crazy locations all around the world and captured every special effect, every abstract landscape, practically. It's hard to believe when you see it, because we're so used to assuming digital effects and shortcuts in movies, but for whatever reason they insisted on doing it all the old-fashioned way. It really enriched the thing.

The Night Of The Hunter

I think this just came out on Blu-ray, and probably looks fantastic. It's a classic film, 1955 I think, but always seems to be forgotten. Southern Gothic. Really worth seeing, still feels really modern to me. It's legitimately scary, beautifully atmospheric. I think few things from the '50s would genuinely create much suspense in today's audiences. I remember seeing this when I was little and it was pretty thrilling. It's a bit like Cape Fear, before Robert Mitchum did, well, Cape Fear.

Was your response to it when you were little the same now, as an adult?

Yeah, you know, I think those responses stay with you for sure. I remember there used to be this god-awful late '70s Close Encounters knockoff that played on local TV all the time when I was little. It was called The Day Time Ended or something, and it used to scare the bejeezus out of me. I don't know why because it was really cheesy. There was something just so strange and creepy about it. There was this family in a remote house being creeped out by lights in the sky and a robot vacuum cleaner coming in through a window and floating through the house, slow-motion little clay aliens appearing out of smoke. I remember talking to my brother about this movie years ago and we realized we both remembered it really well and eventually we tracked it down. I bought it from eBay on VHS for like 75 cents or something — I doubt it's on DVD — and sure enough when I watched it again I got that same creepy feeling.

[Editor's note: The Day Time Ended starred Christopher Mitchum, son of Robert.]

Cat Soup

I think I mentioned before that animation is usually the last thing I ever really want to watch. I'm just weirdly not interested and burnt out on it most of the time. But Cat Soup is another one that's beyond description and my feeble words. It has no dialogue. It was recommended to me by a friend, and I heard some story that it was created by a woman who supposedly killed herself when the movie was completed, but I think that was just a weird rumor. A weird rumor that I just spread again.

But it's about these two kittens who travel into the afterlife, I think, to find their other kitten friend's soul. Its Netflix write-up says, "Their various exploits are turning out to be equal parts marvelous and distressing." Those poor kittens!

“...animation is usually the last thing I ever really want to watch.”

I'm not really well-versed in a lot of Japanese anime, like, not at all. But this one I quite liked a bit. I saw Akira years ago but all I remember are people screaming and blobby things happening.

The General

This is maybe one of the best films ever made! It's pretty much the Citizen Kane of silent films. I don't take sides in the whole Chaplin-Keaton thing, but it's hard to find a better silent film than this. I guess when a movie from 1926 is still really fresh and funny today, that's no small feat. Buster Keaton did all of his own stunts. Not that there were stunt doubles back then, anyway. But this is probably his finest hour in that department.

The whole movie is more or less a train chase, set in the Civil War. It's just all beautiful and flawless. Buster Keaton had a lot of genuine grace to him, too. It's also amazing to watch something like this today and realize when at one point a locomotive is going over a bridge that's blown up, they just rain a train across a bridge and f***ing blew it up.

I saw it when I was pretty young and it sort of was one of those "wow" moments, when you connect with something that's so old, yet so hilarious and perfect, and you realize maybe these old silent films aren't all mothballs and hoary stupid jokes — but something alive and kicking and vital, and funnier and more gracefully made than most movies since.

My only hesitation is that it's public domain so there's probably more than one version floating out there, with possibly bad-music accompaniment. The version I have is in a fancy Keaton box set, so maybe that's the best one to track down? [Others] almost universally [have] Scott Joplin rags, played on an endless loop. It's almost always "The Entertainer" or "Maple Leaf Rag." "This music is about the same age, right?" Yeah, it hurts. Chaplin back in his day, I guess, was so annoyed by the annoying music they'd play over his stuff that he began writing his own for the organists to play.

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